Invisible kitchen

by **Stoo** on Thu Jan 22, 2009 6:36 pm

Anyone got any tips on how to make my kitchen invisible?

I'm planning to renew my kitchen, and I don't want it to look like a kitchen. More like a dining room / lounge. I've got a butler's pantry where I plan to put all the storage, but I want to make the rest of the necessary stuff - sink, hob, oven, fridge - as unobtrusive as possible.

Can you get hobs that completely disappear within a worksurface? What about a sink cut out of a worksurface with a lid to cover it, and discrete taps?

by **timfoley** on Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:32 am

Welcome to the forum Stoo. I was tempted to suggest a visit from Paul Daniels but really wouldn't wish that on anyone.
Enclosed kitchen designs with sliding doors are available from some of the top end retailers that may fit the bill depending on your budget but recreating similar yourself is possible.
Mini or compact kitchens are also available in stainless steel but I may have totally gone off on a different track to what you are actually trying to achieve here.
As far as I am aware there are no hobs that disappear into a worksurface although anything is possible with a little ingenuity and a substantial budget.
Sinks can employ covers and this is something we are often asked to do when fitting Corian. As for appliances, integrated appliances can utilise any style of fascia you wish so it's not necessary to fit a conventional look kitchen door to it.
A bit more info on what type of look you are hoping for might throw up some further options,

Tim

by **Stoo** on Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:28 am

"You'll like this... not a lot, but you'll like it!" (No, lets not go there!)

I do have a pretty clear idea - to me at least - of what I'd like, but I'm still fishing for ideas.

We have a sofa in the kitchen, and spend a lot of time lounging around in there. So my aim is, as much as possible, to make it a nice place to relax whilst still being practical as a kitchen.

Fortunately there's a small pantry attached to the kitchen, so I plan to shift all the cupboards into there. Personally, I'm not a fan of lining kitchen walls with units and worksurface because I think it makes a room seem much smaller, and it means that when you're preparing anything in the kitchen you're facing the wall, with your back to anyone else in the room.

I suppose the obvious answer to this, is some kind of island. But I think you need a really big room for that, don't you? The room I have is roughly 5m x 4m. I'm thinking of getting the obligatory sofa in at one end, then an island with cooker, dishwasher, sink and one storage unit in a single row, and a conventional dining table backing onto it like a peninsular. Do you think I've got the space? What gap do you need around an island for it to comfortably fit in a kitchen?

I like the look of your Corian surfaces. I was thinking of setting an induction hob in one, and a sink with a cover. Can you give me an idea what the cost would be of picture two above, freestanding with the Corian on both ends, with a cut-out for the hob, but only one unit deep? (You're going to tell me it's not Corian now!)

When I was a child, we had an old roll-top bath that had taps set inside the bath, above the overflow, rather than overhanging from above in the conventional setup. If I had a sink with the taps inside it rather than overhanging from above, then I could cover the whole thing. Have you seen anything like that?

Cheers
Stuart

by **timfoley** on Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:18 pm

Stuart,
The taps you speak of were called Globe taps and they are no longer made due to the position of the spout being below the spillover level of the bath. This made them prone to possible back siphonage and contamination of the water supply.No such thing exists for sink tap designs for the same reason.
Criteria for clearances vary and when you consider that a table without occupants sat in the chairs, will also vary depending on the width of the table, that width will increase approximately 1000mm when people are seated. (It's all getting a little Heston Blumenthal now don't you think?) Minimum clearance outside of the necessary space between any elevations such as walls, chairs, cabinets etc, in my opinion and to allow comfortable passage, for entry, access or exit doors, should be 800mm.
Working to the Foley Formula therefore, we have - Width of occupied table + 1600mm = Enough space. Utilising the different horses for different courses formula may negate my whole theory though and you my be happy with less clearance than stated.
Judging by the size of your room it appears you could achieve this depending on the layout of the fixtures and elevations.
As for single row cabinetry, you can achieve a hidden, not invisible look, (Back to Paul Daniels again for that I'm afraid), and this is the method I suggested in my first response. The method and style of fascias with which you enclose this can be more in keeping with your lounge furniture than having a kitchen style finish.
As for an accurate cost for Corian, I'd be reluctant to underestimate or overprice the project without a plan or sketch or some dimensions but what I can say is that we are eager to win all potential clients business and as such our prices reflect that.
If and when you do have an idea of the design you want then send your plans, sketch or even detail the dimensions along with your colour choice, details of any polished returns, upstands, (Coved or straight), drainer grooves, hot rods, sink type and of course whether you will require a sink cover.
We will offer you what I believe will be the most competitive price for template, fabrication and installation.

Tim

by **planetgranite** on Mon Feb 09, 2009 11:40 am

Hi I can make you an invisible hob for your invisible kitchen I have one at my home I live in warwickshire we make granite worktops from our workshop on our farm you are quite welcome to come and visit if you like Im sure you will be more than impressed. It is best that you call me so I can explain in more detail but it works and is a great talking point in our kitchen we put the aga kettle on the worktop and when it starts whistling it freaks people out
give me a call if you like

steve
07968 463822

Stoo wrote:Anyone got any tips on how to make my kitchen invisible?

I'm planning to renew my kitchen, and I don't want it to look like a kitchen. More like a dining room / lounge. I've got a butler's pantry where I plan to put all the storage, but I want to make the rest of the necessary stuff - sink, hob, oven, fridge - as unobtrusive as possible.

Can you get hobs that completely disappear within a worksurface? What about a sink cut out of a worksurface with a lid to cover it, and discrete taps?

by **Majjie** on Fri Feb 13, 2009 10:39 am

I'm intrigued by that Planet Granite solution! I thought you granite people always said that granite needs to be protected from direct heat and pan stands were necessary? Is it ok because it's being heated slowly from cold?

It depends what finishes you want Stoo, as to the best way of disguising your kitchen ... because, lets face it, it's never going to be invisible :lol:

If you go for a wood effect finish for any cabinetry (cherry, say) and black granite for the worktops (or have a look at Tim's sparkly black Prestige quartz) ... then that would look very smart. To my mind Corian would look more like kitchen worktop ... but that may just be me.

You could have a black, flush fitted, touch control, ceramic/induction hob which would be unobtrusive and you could go for an undermounted sink (or sinks) - and possibly get a quartz/granite shape to fit over it (with a hole in the centre for removing it). Alternatively get a black sink. The tap, though is going to be visible. Have a look at designer taps and choose one that, in your opinion, looks like a work of art and make a feature of it - there are some amazing ones around these days.

The appliances could also be black. Try stylish and smart - instead of invisible.

As to the spaces; if it's a working area, without people walking past, I try to make it a minimum of 900mm. If it's more of a thoroughfare, or you've got dishwasher or oven doors opening into it, I'd go for at least 1200mm.

by **Pete H** on Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:33 pm

Stoo

You need to check out 'Silent Move' at *************** I have one here in my showroom. Various designs and sizes for the worktop in natural granite or quartz stone to slide over the hob and indeed options for the sink. When its open you have the facilities and table, when its closed to have a beautiful piece of furniture. You do need a reasonable amount of space and a fairly high budget, but if it fits in the space its very dramatic, a real taking point!
You can even have an electrically operated version with infra-red to detect a pan on the hob to stop it closing! a quite amazing piece of furniture.
Good luck

pete

by **timfoley** on Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:52 pm

Very good post Pete and it does sound like a nice piece of kit but we do have a policy of not allowing links until a number of contributions to the forum are made otherwise we'd just become nothing more than a notice board for retailers.
We like to make industry members work a little harder before links are allowed - I'm sure you understand

Tim

by **Pete H** on Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:57 pm

Sorry Tim, didnt mean to abuse the forum! But at least the sort of product Stuart wants is avaiable!

Pete

by **timfoley** on Thu Jul 23, 2009 4:13 pm

Pete,
No worries and I took the opportunity to take a look at your website.
Congratulations - an excellent site.
How is business in these troubled times?

Tim

by **Pete H** on Thu Jul 23, 2009 8:45 pm

Tim,
Well we are still getting pretty good 'retail' [1 off kitchens to the public] buisness and now their are signs that the contract work is coming back too with sites being taken out of 'mothballs' and properties being sold off plan again so hopefully this will pick up again. Their are still people out there with money to spend on a quality kitchen, you just need to work harder to let them know you are the right people to deal with!
Thanks for your comment on the website, its important to have the right 'window' to show what you can offer.

by **doorstoreonline** on Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:26 am

how interesting it really is amazing what you can do with interior design these days, pretty much anything you can imagine within the relms of architecture is a possibility.

by **Daniel** on Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:38 pm

Some of the 'hidden' kitchens avaliable on the market now are so clever. All the big Italian companies seem to be leading the way in this area as they have been introducing new pocket door ideas and designs for the past few years.

I wish we could post company names (I totally understand why we can't) as there is a really clever one from a certain Italian manufactuer that I certainly believe is the best one at the moment

!!

Unfortunately these designs are restricted to the top end brands though and you have got to be looking at top end budgets for this kind of kitchen ..... it should trickle down soon though to more afordable budgets as designs are copied - in saying that I did once see a less expensive pocket door that worked terribly

by **timfoley** on Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:42 pm

Daniel,
I'm intrigued now so post away. Be good to check this out.

by **Daniel** on Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:41 pm

Thanks Tim

.....

Dada are a TOP end Italian Furniture Manufacturer. Their pocket style door in question is from their Tivali Range ..... [url]http://www.dadaweb.it/cucine/it/Tivalì.php[/url] and they have a patent on the door system.

From what I have seen over the past few years I have always felt the other systems have so many drawbacks in that they were either pretty flimsy in design or simply a restyled sliding door that you would get on any standard sliding wardrobe.

The beauty of the Dada system IMOH is that it completely folds away to reveal the whole kitchen rather than just parts of it, and even then when it's completely folded away you would never know there was a concealed door as it has a finishing panel on its facia - picture 4-5 probably explain that much better than I have just done.

I have tried it out a few times in various exhibitions, and their showroom, and its simply the best out there at the moment I think. The action is very 'natural' and easy to use - you can close each door with one finger !! And unlike many I have seen the design, innovation and construction does perhaps warrent the - admittidly quite high - price tag.

I have no affiliation with Dada by the way.

Hope that’s of interest.

Daniel

P.S Just realised the age of this thread so I hope ‘Stoo’ has his/her kitchen by now !!

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